Guest: Kelly Meerbott Guest Title: Leadership Coach & Speaker
Date: November 8, 2017 Guest Company: YOU: Loud & Clear
Debra: Hello everyone, this is Debra Rue and you are watching or listening to Human Potential At Work. Today I am really excited to bring on Kelly Meerbott. Kelly and I haven’t known each other very long, but Kelly’s one of those people that the minute we met was like oh, hello friend that I didn’t know that I’ve known for a billion years. So Kelly, welcome to the program.
Kelly: Thank you so much, Debra. I’m so glad to be here and I felt the same way about you.
Debra: Yeah, it’s like sometimes you meet people and you’ve just known them forever, so it’s nice to meet you in person since I’ve known you forever obviously.
Kelly: I know. Our souls have known each other.
Debra: I was going to say our souls knew each other. We have so much in common, so I want to talk about your work, your new podcast. I also want to talk about one of your clients, Ken’s Krew and there’s just so much cool stuff to talk about.
Kelly: Your tough.
Debra: But really, the reason why I wanted to have you on the show is because you are a transformational business coach and so I want you to sort of talk about that as well. So first of all, let’s talk about your new podcast. I was really blessed to be your first guest on your podcast. The name of the podcast is Hidden Human, The Stories Behind The Business Leader.
Debra: I’ll tell you Kelly, that you took me places I’ve never ever talked about with anyone. I know that Doug [Forest 00:01:44] is both of our producers and he’s like, “I didn’t know those stories.” You’re a very good interviewer so I’m sure that’s why you’re a really good coach, but tell us more about your podcast.
Kelly: So one of the things I love having, and you and I have experienced that together, is really authentic, real conversations. When I say authentic I don’t mean you and I agreeing on everything. We could have a spirited debate and that’s a great format for conversation. As long as we leave respecting each other, I’m fine with that.
There were so many great conversations I was having that I wanted people to really kind of listen in and find out who the person was behind the title. We all go to these networking events where it’s, “Hi. How are you? What do you do? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.” But it doesn’t tell you who the essence of the person is at the core of who they are and I really wanted to explore the person behind the title.
Debra: You know, the thing that’s interesting also about that is I think the word, I really like the word authenticity, but I think sometimes it’s thrown out, around so much it’s starting to get muddied down.
Debra: I think learning how to be authentic regardless of our fears, regardless of is somebody going to judge me, I can’t say that, I think that sometimes is a real challenge.
Kelly: It is. Yeah, and I totally understand what you mean by the over-use of the word authentic, so it’s really about getting real and dropping whatever masks and stories that we put up for whatever roles we play. One of the things that I hate and I meet sometimes these CEOs and these executives who are incredible at what they do, but when I ask them what they do it feels like a prepared response from their PR Department.
What I really wanted was okay, how did you get from point A to point B? What struggles and what opportunities did you have to fall down and be really resilient and come back up and how did you do that? Because I feel as humans we relate unfortunately more to each other’s failures than we do to our successes, and we learn a lot from our failures, so …
Debra: So true.
Kelly: It’s for me my failures are the greatest lesson, you know? If you fail the class then you’re doomed to repeat it again, which as you know in your life things keep rising up until you deal with them.
Debra: Yeah, and they keep getting harder and harder and harder. But I agree, I think that I haven’t, to be honest, I haven’t always enjoyed my failures certainly while I’m walking them.
Kelly: I didn’t say I liked it.
Debra: I didn’t like it, but they’re always really, really, really valuable lessons. I find as I’m getting older and wiser and through life just beating me down sometimes that or me perceiving that because I don’t think that’s really true. We’re here to experience all kind of things, but you made me think of a conversation I had when I was in Norway.
I went to Norway, beautiful, amazing country, right after the United States elected President Trump in. So it was just like a week or so afterwards. I was little freaked out about the decision that our democracy had made. I honor it, but I was just myself a little nervous about what this would mean to us, and I was talking to a professor there that is a professor of Human Rights and Civil Rights and things like that. He said, “You know, I think a problem that you’re having in the United States is that you talk to each other if you agree.”
So like you Kelly, you and I, we have a lot of the same beliefs, a lot of the same … We’re a lot alike. We believe in making the world a better place, blah, blah, blah. So we hit it off and we have these really rich conversations but what he said really resonated with me because how do I have that kind of really authentic conversation with somebody that just is the polar opposite of who I am and how can I … I know you and I have had these conversations. How can I seek to understand your perspective so that I can learn?
So I think that’s another reason why your voice is very important because I think that’s what we are trying to do certainly in the United States. Not everybody, but I think there’s a lot more of let me try to understand the perspective that you’re coming from because I don’t understand, I don’t agree with you, but maybe I don’t understand all the nuances and after it’s said and done, maybe I can learn from you.
Kelly: Well, I agree with you and I think that there is this phenomenon going on where we’re almost on outrage overload. It’s like we can’t even say, wish somebody a holiday greeting without somebody getting upset about it, you know?
Kelly: I think that in order to have a spirited debate, and I had this with one of my neighbors who I like this guy, we go to dinner with him, he’s really, really nice, our political views are completely opposite, but I can tell you just by having that dialogue with him, we didn’t get personal. All we did was we discussed the issues. At the end it was like I don’t agree with you, I don’t agree with you. Okay, let’s part ways and I think there’s a lot of value in that, but …
Debra: I agree.
Kelly: … I think that our society has gotten to the point where were shouting each other down and we’re not listening for understanding. We’re listening for the point to get oh my gosh, I’m so upset. It’s almost like we thrive on this outrage loop, which is sad because I think we’re missing the opportunity to learn from each other’s differences. You know?
Kelly: When he explained to me why he voted the way he voted it made sense to me, you know?
Debra: Right, right.
Kelly: I have to respect that.
Debra: Right, and I’ve had a lot of those conversations too and I’ve learned quite a bit and I have actually had people that voted differently from me change my mind about certain issues or not … Or enhance my mind in some cases. I still would have continued to vote the way I voted, and I believe these people that I’m debating with probably would as well, but seeking to understand I think helps us all transform our lives.
I know that’s what you do for a living, so tell us more about, of course Kelly, you know I’m very engaged in making sure that we’re tapping into full human potential and I really like having guests on that are in the disability field or have disabilities themselves, but as we all know, abilities and disabilities, it’s all part, a very normal part of the human experience. We all have them. We all have them, so you do a lot of transformational type leadership coaching with CEOs all over the United States and some are global, so how are you having these conversations? How can you have impact especially during what some people would consider very traumatic times?
Kelly: Yeah. So the way I usually open up a new relationship with a client is I set ground rules so they know where they’re going. It’s almost like a guide map. One of the things I say is, “This relationship is unlike any other in your life. I’m here with no other agenda than to hold you accountable to your fullest potential.” That’s it.
Debra: That’s a good one.
Kelly: That is it. That’s the bottom line. I am not here for me. The reason I named my company You Loud and Clear is because it’s not about me. It’s about how can I hold you accountable to the best version of yourself? That is not my plan. That’s your plan. What does it look like in your mind? How do you want to execute that? How do you see yourself getting there and then we reverse engineer the plan to get them there.
So I’ll give you an example. I had a client, a CEO of a 70 million dollar company in Florida. He was amazing. We just ended our year and a half agreement. I still love him. We still correspond, but he said to me, “I want to be a statesman. I need to be less of a locker room pal and I need to be more of a statesman.” I said to him, “Okay, in my mind a statesman is Winston Churchill. That’s what I think of. Who do you think of? Who do you think of? Tell me what that looks like in your mind? How do they show up in the world? How do they behave?”
Then we sketched out that idea and i just held him accountable along the way to hitting those milestones. Of course as we are human we evolve and change, and as he did that plan may shift and ebb and flow. Again, it’s my job to be almost the GPS, like, “Hey, have you considered this? Oh, we need to recalculate and go this way? Okay, that’s fine,” because they’re really pacing it out.
I’m having really powerful conversations, you know? There’s a lot of people out there having a huge positive impact on the world and I am so grateful and so honored to be part of their journey, to walk alongside them on their path, whatever that is. This is for me, and I’ve said this to you before, it’s not a job I do. It’s what I was born to do. This is what I was born to do.
Debra: Right, and we know when we’re there. We know when we’re doing what we’re supposed to be doing. At least I guess I can only talk for myself, but I know the other day I was really blessed to be speaking in Geneva at the United Nations International Labor Organization and …
Kelly: The world changer.
Debra: I know. Yeah, it was really, really cool, but it was interesting. I was nervous even though I speak all the time, but when it was my turn to start I actually got a little tongue-tied and luckily it’s on video so anybody can watch and see me, that happen. I remember thinking oh, you cannot get tongue-tied right now. Stop it, which of course [inaudible 00:12:07] a little bit more tongue-tied.
I recovered. I recovered and I’m sure the audience was like oh, she’s a human being. Okay, cool. So it’s just funny. We try to hold ourselves so accountable so high and sometimes we’re just human, but it’s … I think having these authentic conversations and helping each other along the way, and we do need help along the way, so I think that your work is very valuable and I really encourage my audience to check out Kelly’s podcast. We’re doing a lot of advertising it, both Kelly and myself right now. Really encouraging people to listen to it, subscribe to it, to suggest guests for Kelly. If you want to be a guest.
Debra: Yeah. I think it is very interesting. How do you get from I want to do this to actually, what was the journey? I’ll tell you Kelly, and I’ve told you this before, I don’t know why I assume this, but I assume sometimes, and I’ve grown out of this, but that business leaders, they just had the secret sauce. They knew what they were doing and they just went from, “I’m going to build a very successful business,” and they just did it. Instead of realizing that that’s not really how it does. It is very curvy, the journey, the path that you’re following down.
I do this, and I know you’re the same way because I’ve a very, very high, big faith, and I remember my faith through prayers and meditation I’m thinking I’ve got to make a difference for the community of people with disabilities. It’s like great idea. Then I would run forward, smash into a brick wall. My nose is all bloody and I’m like oh, well. Then it would be like in my mediations I would feel like God or the universe is saying, “Okay, so would you like a little help? Because if you want to run and figure it out yourself you can. It might be a little bit more painful, but you know, go for it.”
So when I started my company Rue Global Communications I stopped that. I’m not saying I don’t make mistakes because I’m the queen of mistakes, but I really am trying to let the universe, God, whatever you, people, whatever somebody would call it themselves, flow through me so that I can create the best, the biggest impact.
Kelly: Right. Well, and speaking of flow, you and I talked about, we were talking about work/life balance and I think that’s such a …. First of all, I think that’s the wrong term because I don’t think there is such a thing. I think we flow with whatever happens in the day. There are days that like you said, where you had to run to catch a plane to get to Geneva to speak to dah, dah, dah, dah and that’s not a balanced day.
But you come home that weekend, you hang out with your husband, you spend time in the garden, you spend time with your daughter, that’s more of a flow that balances out. I think a lot of times these labels that we put on top of things add a lot of pressure because it’s like oh, work/life balance, we should be balanced all the time. Who is? Really? Is there somebody out there that’s balanced because …
Debra: I’d like to see it.
Kelly: … I’d like to see it. If they did they went on one heck of a spiritual journey. That’s great, but realistically we really need to be able to pivot and move as life moves with us. That’s …
Debra: Nice words.
Kelly: That’s my opinion and everybody has one.
Debra: Yeah, but I agree. Well, let’s spend a little bit of time talking about a couple of your projects.
Debra: I know that you love Soul Cycle, which I had never heard of.
Kelly: Yes, love it.
Debra: I’m fascinated with. Then also I want to talk a little bit about Kin’s Crew if you don’t mind …
Debra: … exploring that a little bit.
Kelly: Absolutely. I’d love to.
Debra: I tossed you two balls. Go.
Kelly: Okay, so Soul Cycle I could take up the rest of the time about. I rode this morning with the Soul family in Ardmore led by the amazing Ryan Lewis and we rode to Billy Joel and Journey, so it was a big let’s just say it was a big karaoke bar of people sweating and riding bikes. It was just, it was a blast.
Soul Cycle has been a light in my life. I rode my first ride on May 28th, 2016 and I’m going to ride my 500th not this Saturday but next Saturday. They just ignited a light inside of me that had been squashed out by things. I was in my own head and had no outlet and no … I had my therapist, but not this way. This is literally a mind, body, spirit, heart connection. I think the most important thing is I found my tribe. I found people who get me.
They get it and they don’t question if I do something crazy in class or if I accidentally snot mucus on them during class because you do, that happens. When you’re doing an intense workout it happens. These are just people that are not only an amazing part of the pack, but they’re incredible humans. They’re doing so many incredible things. Soul Cycle is just, like I said, elevating that and holding them to their potential. They’re doing that through a physical movement that ends up being a moving meditation.
Debra: What is Soul Cycle because I’m sure a lot of people don’t know what it is, so tell us what it is?
Kelly: Yeah, so because people always say to me, “Isn’t it just spinning?” Well no, it’s not. In fact the way I like to talk about it is if anybody is a fan of Tyler Perry, I saw him a couple of weeks or months ago on YouTube and he was on this talk show. The woman said, “Okay,” with one of the Soul Cycle instructors. She’s like, “It’s just spinning.” He goes, “No. It’s my church. It’s where I work …
Debra: Oh wow.
Kelly: … things out in my head.” That’s exactly why it attracts all these celebrities. Soul Cycle is indoor cycling, but it’s done in candlelight and you ride to the rhythm of the music and you’re led by instructors that have been there. When I say that I mean for instance Ryan Lewis, he would tell you this if he was standing right here. He’s 27, he’s just celebrated three years sobriety and I always call him my Buddha on a bike because he’s lived so much life that he just really knows exactly what to do.
For instance, I’ve been having really bad couple weeks energetically and you know that, and I walked into class on Wednesday and the song after our weight set is called Soulful. It’s very moving meditation and he played George Michael’s faith. That was the perfect song. That’s exactly what I needed to hear. That was … You know what I mean?
Debra: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Kelly: They do this messaging in there that talks about really being part of the pack and going further together and it’s not competitive at all. We all cheer each other on and lift each other up. I’ve released 60 pounds in the process, which I’m really, really happy about. I’m healthier and I always joke that before Soul Cycle if my husband and I ever had a heated discussion I would take a swan dive into the nearest plate of Ben & Jerry’s, but now it’s okay, who’s teaching?
Who’s teaching because these are people that are literally bearers of light for our path when our path is not illuminated the way it should be. They’re leading by example. That’s just one story. Denida Elizabeth who’s an amazing instructor, she grew up in Detroit. Her dream was to move to New York and be a Soul Cycle instructor, so she did. She started by cleaning the studios. She worked her way up. She’s been a Soul Cycle instructor for nine months and she’s released 160 pounds.
Kelly: How’s that story to help inspire other people to be the best versions of themselves? They’re not just talking and all this motivational, like, you know, pretty words. They’re living this. They’re lived it and they’re leveraging their mistakes and their life’s journeys to help us on ours.
To me there’s no higher calling than that. I am forever grateful to Elizabeth Cutler and Julia Rice for founding this. I’m grateful to Soul Cycle for being here in Ardmore and in Philly and I’m grateful to everybody, from the staff that cleans those studios to the people I ride with. They’re just a gift and I couldn’t say more about them. They’re amazing people.
Debra: Wow. It sounds like a beautiful experience.
Kelly: Yeah, it really is. It really is. My prayer every time I set up my bike is thank you God for allowing me to be able to do something like this. Thank you. Thank you. Because I know it’s a gift and a privilege and I don’t take that lightly at all. Sorry, I knew I was going to cry, I just didn’t expect Soul Cycle. Yeah, but that’s the story right there.
Debra: I know that you have worked a little bit with Ken’s Krew.
Debra: I had known about their work for years, was always very impressed. They used to be called Ken’s Kids. Do you mind just telling the audience a little bit about what they’re doing? Because it continues to really impress me with being a really amazing program.
Kelly: Absolutely. Do you mind if we step back for a second and take the broader version of that you and I have talked about diversity and inclusion and how it’s not especially when it comes to people with disabilities, this is not some warm and fuzzy or as I was corrected, pulling on people’s heartstrings. It’s just good business.
It’s smart business and it’s bringing people from different perspectives into your organization that have a different view and your life and your business and your bottom line will be enriched by their experience. So Ken’s Krew was founded by, and I’m probably going to get his title incorrect, so forgive me, but was founded by the Chairman and CEO of Home Depot, Kenny Langone. Basically it takes people with disabilities, adults with disabilities, and places them in gainful employment.
So a lot of them work at Home Depot and I was fortunate to walk around with Karen [Laperra 00:22:58] who’s part of the leadership team at Ken’s Krew, and she introduced me to a lot of the managers and the adults that work that are part of the program, Ken’s Krew Program, and one of my favorite experiences was with one of the managers who I said, because I was asking him a lot of questions, I said, “How has this program changed you?”
He said, “It made me a better leader. It just made me a better leader.” He said, “I know how to get the best out of everybody no matter where they come from.” He said, “And I don’t underestimate these adults because one of them,” and I can’t remember the gentleman’s name, came to him and they were like, “Oh, he’s just capable of breaking down boxes.” Well, this leader was like, “No, I can get more out of him so let me see how far I can push him.”
He said, “And sometimes we went a little too far, and that’s okay, and sometimes you have to pull it back,” but they are incredible. What really, really impressed me was every adult that I met, I don’t think that they had worked at Home Depot any less than 10 years. So it was like 10 years, 16 years, 18 years. There’s so much pride in the work and I told you this story about, oh gosh, I wish I remembered his name. I can see his face right in my head, but it was one of the adults and I said to him, “Why do you like working at Home Depot?”
He said, “Because I like it.” I thought yeah, that’s it. That’s the end of the story, you know? He was like, kind of like okay, now I’m going to go back to my work. Stop talking to me.
Debra: I’m at work. Leave me alone.
Kelly: Yeah, I’m at work. I’m trying to [inaudible 00:24:39] work. You know what’s so great about Ken’s Krew is they provide a job coach to walk alongside the adults, so these job coaches know the culture of the organization and help implement it with the adults. So if there’s a challenge on the work site they go in and correct it. Home Depot’s HR doesn’t need to get involved. The managers just call and connect with the job coach and say, “Hey, Sarah was having a challenge today with being on time. Can you work on her …”
They come in and they come alongside and make sure that these adults are in alignment with the organization, which for me is just such a, it’s a gift on both sides. Home Depot gets this great, dedicated, passionate worker and this worker who a lot of the parents I spoke to would have been sitting at home playing video games, wasting time, not having any value for themselves or for the world, which is everybody wants to contribute in whatever way it is.
Ken’s Krew is doing so much great work and now we’re looking for additional retail partners. We’ve started talks with Michael’s. This is just a great program and just like I said, it makes sense. Is it a nice program? Is it happy and warm and fuzzy? Absolutely. But bottom line …
Debra: Nothing wrong with that.
Kelly: … these stores, and actually Home Depot did a study to see how this was impacting them. I think it impacted their bottom line something like 30% more.
Kelly: That’s incredible. You could speak to the statistics better than I could, Debra because it’s more of a global phenomenon and it’s what you do, so I’m again, it’s a gift to be involved in relationship building with Ken’s Krew. When you’re born to do this and you’re given a gift to help make a deeper impact in a positive way in the world, to me it’s just a win-win all around.
Debra: I agree. You introduced me to the people at Ken’s Krew and I was, my daughter Sarah, born with Down Syndrome, she has a friend that worked at Home Depot with Ken’s Krew in Pennsylvania.
Kelly: You’re kidding?
Debra: Yeah, no.
Kelly: That’s awesome.
Debra: She loved it. She loved it. She loved it. Then she moved to Richmond, Virginia and the program isn’t here unfortunately. We would love for it to come.
Kelly: Yes. Yet, yet.
Debra: Yet, because we want it. We want it to be here.
Kelly: Come on Virginia.
Debra: Yes. We want it here, but they were just disappointed because there were very little options for her. She still talks about it and it’s been like eight years since she moved to Virginia. I love the program because they’re actually employees making the same marketable salary, getting the same benefits as all of their peers. They’ve done lots of research on the customer and how they’re responding, how productive are the employees and the numbers are pretty significant and very exciting.
Kelly: They’re impressive too and they’re only in seven states.
Debra: I know. I know.
Kelly: [inaudible 00:27:51] the whole country, the lives we could change with this program, it just, it blows my mind.
Debra: I know. It’s very powerful and I shop at Home Depot because of this. I really believe in standing by brands that stand by our community and so I’ve very, very impressed that they do that.
Kelly: Do you do this Debra, I don’t know if you do this, but I do this, I will drive 15 minutes out of my way to support a store that I know is …
Kelly: … is socially responsible.
Debra: Oh, absolutely.
Kelly: And also [inaudible 00:28:24]I don’t care. If I know that this is first of all if it’s local, if it’s a local small business that’s doing something socially responsible I will go out of my way to support them.
Debra: Right, and the millennials definitely do this and there’s been lots of studies proving that as well. They will spend more money to do business with socially responsible corporations. Very important stuff.
Debra: I totally agree. So I really in the future we’re going to have Ken’s Krew come on the program and really talk about what they’re doing and really get into it more, but I was really happy that you were working with them and trying to help them expand into other states, into other, hopefully other retail areas like Michael’s and others. If any retail companies want to reach out to Kelly about working with Ken’s Krew, we know they have very dependable, very reliable employees that they can bring to the table, employees with disabilities, so it’s very exciting.
Kelly: Well, and the other thing is they do a lot and we talked about this on our conference call, they do a five step screening process not only with the adult, but with their parents. This is a holistic, they’re really coming in and supporting and it’s no cost to the family. There’s no cost to the family. Some of these parents that I talk to, they were just over the moon. They are so grateful to Ken’s Krew, like I said, to Karen and to everybody on the team and what they’re doing and the board is incredible.
These are just really, again, and I’m sorry, I’m just getting a little awareness in my mind about how many incredible people that I have in my life. To be surrounded by people at Ken’s Krew and to be allowed to do this on behalf of them, it just, it’s an honor. It really is. I always say I’m kind of swimming in a pool of gratitude.
Debra: Yeah, absolutely. Just for the listeners, they’re typically working with adults with intellectual or cognitive disabilities.
Debra: Which is why you would bring the families into it because obviously my husband and I really support our daughter a lot even though she’s a 30-year-old. We support our son too, but he doesn’t need right now as much support as our daughter does. Yeah, so it’s a very important part to make sure all of the stakeholders are brought in. Kelly, I know that we’re almost out of time, but tell us how we can learn more about your work. How can we find out about you? How could we use you as a transformational coach, do business with you? How can we find out about your podcasts? This is a time for you to tell everybody how to find you.
Kelly: Sure. So my website is YouLoudAndClear.com. It’s all spelled out, so it’s Y-O-U-L-O-U-D-A-N-D-C-L-E-A-R.com. I know it’s a long URL, but that’s what it is. You can find me there. I’m on social media, I’m on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, LinkedIn. LinkedIn actually has about 67 references from clients, former clients, people who have experienced my work so if you want to check me out there.
Then of course my email address is Kelly, excuse me. [email protected] so you can always reach out. The way to work with me best, I always like to have a conversation first to find out where you are and where I am and if I’m a good match for you, because one thing I always tell people is when you’re looking for a coach, the first thing you need to look for is chemistry. If there’s no chemistry then it doesn’t make sense.
So I usually gift people a 90 minute coaching session, so if any of your viewers or listeners would like that from the program and they just email me and reference that, I’d be happy to gift them that.
Debra: Thank you.
Kelly: Because it’s a way for me to really understand if I can help them at the level that they want. Because one of the things I say to them is this is a relationship like none other. Whatever the strongest commitment that you have in your life, a relationship with me is right there. I’m going to come alongside you and give you everything that I have in my reality to help you get where you want to be.
I can only do that through a conversation. Now, if at the end of those 90 minutes I feel like I’m not the right person to serve and support you, I have a roster of experts that I’ve personally vetted that I can match you with. That’s just my gift to you because it’s really your journey and how you want to use it, you know? If you want to be the best that you can possibly be and be living at your highest potential and vibrating at levels of abundance, then come talk to me.
Debra: I agree. We enjoyed talking to you today, so Kelly, thank you so much for being on the program and …
Kelly: Thank you so much.
Debra: … special thanks to Doug, yeah, for bringing us together. I love your energy and I love your work. I hope you help Ken’s Krew be wildly successful, even more successful than they already are.
Kelly: Debra, I’m honored to be in your orbit. Just you are such a powerful creator and you are doing so many powerful things in this world.
Debra: Thank you.
Kelly: We need you and I am grateful for you and what you’re doing, so thank you so much.
Debra: Thank you Kelly. Okay, so talk to everybody soon. Bye bye.
You’ve been listening to Human Potential at Work with Debra Ruh. To learn more about Debra and how she can help your organization visit RuhGlobal.com. If you’ve enjoyed today’s episode and you want to make sure that you don’t miss any future epsiodes, go to itunes and subscribe to Human Potential at Work. Thanks so much for listening and we’ll be back next week with a new episode.